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  • PSC Forum
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  •  » Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

#51 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 7:16 AM

david38off
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

Just a side note on a post above.  I dont think anyone should be "called out" for expressing an opinion on this forum unless they use profanity or vulgar language.  I dont think the purpose of a forum on this site is to promote products per se'.  The purpose of the forum is for  skiers to express their opinions and findings regarding new equipment and new ideas regarding technique, etc.  I think it is ok for someone to have a difference of opinion about a product, a ski or whatever, as long as they are not vulgar, or making it a personal attack on an individual.  I (personally) would be more likely to try a product after hearing both good and bad opinions about it.  If all I hear is positive feedback from the guys selling the product I am less likely to pay atention to it, and more likely to view it as a simple advertisement.

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#52 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 7:52 AM

Deke
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

Hey David,  I have "heard" that hard drive type or mini disk type cameras are very sensitive to vibration and will do what you described above.  In fact, the Trakker website talks about this.  Yes, it is most likely vibration coming through the pylon that is causing it.  I have an older model Trakker and an older video camera where the vibration makes you think you are seeing double.  That is why I am following this thread and hoping to pick some better equipment.  My Flip is on order and I'll try it with the old Trakker but may need to upgrade that too.

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#53 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 8:15 AM

HO410
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

david38off, what exactly is happening? You set the camera to record and only get the 10-15 seconds before the boat takes off? Do you get the 10-15 seconds before taking off and then get black or garbled video for the full length of the pass? If it's the prior, it seems like the vibration is, in one way or another, tricking the record button into activating. Stupid idea, try leaving the camera in standby and see if it starts to record when you hit the gas.



Some cameras are more sensitive to vibration than others.
I've talked to enough skiers to confidently suggest the Flip cameras. I do not personally own one, but they are showing to be rugged little cameras with acceptable video quality.

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#54 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 9:14 AM

Trakker
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

Just saw the recent activity on this thread yesterday.  Thank you to everyone for the feedback.  Feedback helps us decide where to spend our resources.

The Trakker is meant to be a training aid and an alternative to hand held recording.  Yes, hand held video is usually better, however it is not always possible to get someone committed to recording every pass.  The Trakker is a great solution for this.

We have a hard time keeping up with camera types and which ones work well with the Trakker, but I just sent out an email with some sample video using different types of cameras with the Trakker.  I will copy that part of the email below this paragraph.  Basically, we have had trouble with some of the new Canons with the CMOS image sensor.  Most cameras using the Flash memory cards will work with the Trakker.  There are a few other cameras that have trouble, but I do not have enough information to provide accurate information here.  Samples below:

Here is the comparison video:
http://www.youtube.com/user/spyd4r#p/u/22/fSWDP1Tsj1Y
You can see other videos on his YouTube page typical of how the Trakker should work.

Here is a video using the Flip Video camera:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDYrSFBMgtQ

Here is one using the Canon Powershot A560 digital camera:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPhll1e6-Kw

Here is one using the Canon 5D Mark II in 1920x1080:
http://combier.smugmug.com/gallery/8472 … 9670_bDxvP

Vibrations reduction has been a continuous effort and we have spent a lot of time getting the Trakker to work as well as it currently does.  We are always working on improvements and will introduce those improvements as they happen.

To end on a good note - Last year I sent a Trakker to Will Asher and here is what he had to say about it:
ď...Very impressed with the stability, and simplicity.  Just what I have been looking for.  Thank you again.Ē  Will Asher-2009 and 2005 World Slalom Champion

Last edited by Trakker (Wed, Mar 10, 2010 9:16 AM)

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#55 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 9:52 AM

Jhughes
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

david38off wrote:

Just a side note on a post above.  I dont think anyone should be "called out" for expressing an opinion on this forum unless they use profanity or vulgar language.  I dont think the purpose of a forum on this site is to promote products per se'.  The purpose of the forum is for  skiers to express their opinions and findings regarding new equipment and new ideas regarding technique, etc.  I think it is ok for someone to have a difference of opinion about a product, a ski or whatever, as long as they are not vulgar, or making it a personal attack on an individual.  I (personally) would be more likely to try a product after hearing both good and bad opinions about it.  If all I hear is positive feedback from the guys selling the product I am less likely to pay atention to it, and more likely to view it as a simple advertisement.

Of course. I think you're missing my point. hmm

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#56 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 1:09 PM

david38off
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

Deke wrote:

Hey David,  I have "heard" that hard drive type or mini disk type cameras are very sensitive to vibration and will do what you described above.  In fact, the Trakker website talks about this.  Yes, it is most likely vibration coming through the pylon that is causing it.  I have an older model Trakker and an older video camera where the vibration makes you think you are seeing double.  That is why I am following this thread and hoping to pick some better equipment.  My Flip is on order and I'll try it with the old Trakker but may need to upgrade that too.

Yes I believe the camera has some sort of "hard drive" component to it.  It is a JVC Everio camcorder. (2008). It says Hard disk camcorder on the side of the camcorder, but does have a "card" that is withdrawn and placed into the computer for viewing??  Not sure if this is the type you are talking about.  Would be interested in knowing of some brands and model numbers that Trakker knows for sure works well with their system. (In addition to the Canon s they mention above).  I do think the trakker is pretty good idea, esp as I rarely have a third in the boat.  But I do like to see companies always trying to improve on their systems too.  Thanks

Last edited by david38off (Wed, Mar 10, 2010 1:23 PM)

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#57 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 1:29 PM

david38off
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

HO410 wrote:

david38off, what exactly is happening? You set the camera to record and only get the 10-15 seconds before the boat takes off? Do you get the 10-15 seconds before taking off and then get black or garbled video for the full length of the pass? If it's the prior, it seems like the vibration is, in one way or another, tricking the record button into activating. Stupid idea, try leaving the camera in standby and see if it starts to record when you hit the gas.



Some cameras are more sensitive to vibration than others.
I've talked to enough skiers to confidently suggest the Flip cameras. I do not personally own one, but they are showing to be rugged little cameras with acceptable video quality.

I set the camera to record, and immediately after pulling up the skier (less than 1 sec) it shuts off.  Blank screen and a message ( I am sorry it is cold and we arent skiing here yet so havent tried it since sept...so I dont remember what exactly the message says ) appears on the camcorder...something like video recording stopped?? It doesnt record anything during the pass or after..it just turns off.   So it seems that the vibration of pulling the skier up is turning off the camcorder.  I dont think it has anything to do with the trakker exactly, except that it appears just pulling the skier up is too much vibration for the camcorder on the trakker.

Last edited by david38off (Wed, Mar 10, 2010 1:31 PM)

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#58 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 1:36 PM

HO410
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

I would guess that you are getting an error that says something along the lines of, "Unable to write to media." Try recording to a MicroSD card: the solid state media will be much more stable than the 60 GB harddrive.

I took a quick look at the camera specs and I saw that the image sensor is a CMOS chip. This is the same type of censor that some Cannon models use, and those cameras are known to have image quality problems with the camera is vibrating. If this is the problem, there is not much to do with the camera itself. I would refer you over to the following thread at fifteenoff.com (http://fifteenoff.com/forum/default.asp … &t=644) where there is some discussion on making a buffer between the mounting bracket and the pylon.

Last edited by HO410 (Wed, Mar 10, 2010 1:48 PM)

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#59 Wed, Mar 10, 2010 6:56 PM

david38off
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

I checked and it does have a micro SD card in it that comes out of the bottom and is placed in the computer for viewing.  ??

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#60 Thu, Mar 11, 2010 7:03 AM

HO410
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

Aside from telling the camera to write to the SD card, it will not change how you use the camera. You should still be able to review and move video files in whatever manner you currently use.

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#61 Tue, May 25, 2010 10:25 AM

BudMan
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Registered: Tue, Nov 24, 2009
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

I have heard about cameras having sensors that are not adjustable. i.e. Moisture sensors that will shut the unit of until the moisture is gone. I would guess that a camera could have a vibration sensor as well. You might call tech support of the manufacture with your question.
I built a camera mount about 20 years ago. I donít remember seeing one before I built mine, but I canít imagine that it was an original idea of mine. I must have seen one and just donít remember. Does any one know how long Tracker has been around? I first set the camera on a tripod and my girls, youngest 5, would video me. We then got an inboard and I modified the top of the tripod to mount on the pylon. This worked great. There was a loose connection within the swivel that inhibited the vibration from transferring to the camera and allowed the camera to keep up with the skier in the preturn as he broke free of the boat. Keep in mind this was before camera stabilization. Or at the least mine did not have it. That swivel eventually wore out and I re-did the apparatus with a bearing swivel. This tightened up the connection and transferred the vibration from the engine right to the camera. I mounted four vibration dampers and that took care of the vibration. The other problem then showed up with the bearing; not enough free swing. It would keep up in the pull but when you got free of the boat and the rope would sway, you would ski out of the frame. I think that sounds better than ďI got slackĒ. My perspectives of things are always changing so maybe my skiing was such that I was the only problem and not the bearing. Iím posting a picture. Maybe Tracker can get some ideas for a damper from mine. They are welcome to use any aspect with no obligation to me. I really want to get back to videoing. It helped me then and I think it would really help me know. I know without a doubt that what you feel and think is not always what you see.
http://www.proskicoach.com/forum/uploads/6212_dsc01225.jpg


Life is great! Enjoy every minute!

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#62 Wed, May 26, 2010 6:10 AM

Deke
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

What did you use for vibration isolation?  I have an older Trakker that could stand a little of that.

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#63 Mon, Jun 7, 2010 6:44 PM

BudMan
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

I apologize for not seeing your post earlier. There is a company called MOR/ryde that makes suspension systems for travel trailers. Some where back in the 70ís, I got some samples at a dealer show. Iíll bet if you call them and ask for four samples, they would accommodate you. Good luck and again, sorry for the delayed response.

Last edited by BudMan (Mon, Jun 7, 2010 6:45 PM)


Life is great! Enjoy every minute!

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#64 Mon, Jun 7, 2010 6:57 PM

Skiboy
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

Would love to try one, any dealers up here in Canada? Or what would one cost shipped up here?


Skiing Finatic Once Again

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#65 Tue, Jun 8, 2010 6:08 AM

Deke
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

BudMan wrote:

I apologize for not seeing your post earlier. There is a company called MOR/ryde that makes suspension systems for travel trailers. Some where back in the 70ís, I got some samples at a dealer show. Iíll bet if you call them and ask for four samples, they would accommodate you. Good luck and again, sorry for the delayed response.

Budman, are you using dampers between the bracket and pylon, or between the bracket and the camera mount?

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#66 Wed, Jun 9, 2010 5:47 AM

h20dawg79
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

Deke,
What camera are you using and still getting effects from vibration?  (I'm still debating on buying one of the Flip cam's...)


"Warning" -the Surgeon General has determined; That the preceding statements accurately reflect the views and opinions consistent with "DSS" (Delusional Slalomitis Syndrome) a highly contagious life altering condition... (Handle with Extreme care & Patience)

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#67 Wed, Jun 9, 2010 6:06 AM

Deke
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

I bought a Flip but have not used it yet.  The vibration issues were from my old Sony.  I'm just sort of preparing in case it happens again.  Believe it or not I've only been on the water once this season.

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#68 Wed, Jun 9, 2010 6:36 AM

h20dawg79
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Re: Trakker Video Camera Mounts for Water Skiing and Wake Boarding.

Deke wrote:

I bought a Flip but have not used it yet.  The vibration issues were from my old Sony.  I'm just sort of preparing in case it happens again.  Believe it or not I've only been on the water once this season.



I hear ya! Me too...sad (1 trip to the course and a some free skiing for me.) A shiny new trakker that I bought last yr. and no camera! roll


"Warning" -the Surgeon General has determined; That the preceding statements accurately reflect the views and opinions consistent with "DSS" (Delusional Slalomitis Syndrome) a highly contagious life altering condition... (Handle with Extreme care & Patience)

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