Good open water ski for the aggressive skiing big man? / Pro Ski Coach Water Ski Forum

maverick2 · #1 Sun, Oct 31, 2010 11:10 PM

I’m looking to make a ski upgrade this next year and am looking for suggestions. I’m currently skiing the Connelly Outlaw, and would like to jump up a performance level. I’m 6’2”, tip the scales at 260#, and ski open water exclusively (no course in our neck of the woods). In looking thru previous posts, I see the Connelly F1X, HO A1, and Radar Senate (or Senate-C) commonly mentioned as likely performance skis for big guys, so this probably makes up my initial list of demo skis for next spring. Most of these posts speak more to course skiing rather than open water skiing however, so I’m curious which skis would be best suited to choppy water, inconsistent water conditions, and greater variety in tow boats (ie., read between the lines here and assume we have more opportunity to ski behind larger waked IO’s than tournament style inboards)? What ski attributes tend to lend themselves well to open water skiing?

We demo’ed an HO Triumph one weekend alongside the Outlaw this summer and I was disappointed with the Triumph. I caught glimpses here and there of better acceleration and edge-holding capability with the Triumph, but the water was so choppy and chewed up the entire time (more than normal) that the weekend really only showed us which ski was more forgiving and had the larger sweet spot. Unfortunately, a little chop and inconsistency in our water is the norm, so rough water attributes are important in a ski.

For what it’s worth, I’m 48 years old, very strong and athletic, have been slalom skiing for 35+ years, and tend to favor skis that have full double boots, accelerate well, and hang hard in corners.

Thoughts?

h20dawg79 · #2 Mon, Nov 1, 2010 12:45 AM

Welcome Mav!

I would suggest trying out the Radar Senate (not the C) and the Theory side by side and your search will be over! One of those will meet your needs I'm sure. By trying out both at the same time you can do a side by side performance comparison... Maybe go to H2osmosis if you don't have access to these where you are at.

Those ski's will be the best choice for the cond.'s that you describe. But, no ski is going to make tough cond.'s really Good...

http://www.radarskis.com/skis.html -Just click on the ski and check out the info., video and spec's...

Good Luck!

maverick2 · #3 Mon, Nov 1, 2010 1:53 AM

Thanks -- I have access to a pretty good ski shop and should be able to get a side-by-side with all the skis listed. Out of curiosity, what ski attributes make you suggest the 2 Radars over something like the F1X for this application? I'd like to understand the theory as much as possible, so that when I demo the various skis, I can begin to make sense of WHY they feel the way they do... (I'm guessing the Senate-C's ligher weight is probably a detriment in my application?!?!?) What performance advantages should I feel with the Theory or Senate in comparison to the Outlaw?

I'm quite a ways outside the recommended weight range for anything from Radar, so I'm assuming I'll be skiing them 32-34 mph rather than 30-32. I'm comfortable in that range, but I've read a fair number of threads regarding skis "falling flat" when skied outside their designed speed range. When/where does that come into play, and is that a "real" factor outside of course skiing?

I can lose a little tonnage over the winter to lessen the gap a bit, but 240-245# is pretty optimal for me, so I'd like to understand the weight/speed ratings of skis a bit better as well...

Thanks!

h20dawg79 · #4 Mon, Nov 1, 2010 1:23 PM

I can't say exactly what differences you will find personally. But, I am very confident in those two ski's and feel that between those two, you will find a winner without driving yourself crazy trying to split hairs over several different ski's...

I do ski on public waters, -both free skiing and in the course. The Theory will work fine at 32-34mph on open water in less then ideal water cond's... (I have done it) But, it is more at Home at 32mph and under. The Senate is absolutely more perf. But, might be a bit less stable for you. The Senate "C" would be much better for the course, because of it's quicker response/reaction.(carbon) but, will also have a less dampening ride. (less forgiving to skier and cond's...) So, the reg. Senate would be the better choice for open water.

Bindings will also effect the way a ski feels and performs. The Radar sequence plate/Bindings can be easily moved from ski to ski for a better ski comparison.

davemac · #5 Mon, Nov 1, 2010 1:34 PM

If interested...it looks like Radar is offering a ridiculously low closeout price on the 2010 Senate

www.radarskistore.com/products/productd … 0.0.0.0.0?

edit...looks like deal was too good to last...price was bumped

Last edited by davemac (Wed, Nov 3, 2010 7:40 PM)

h20dawg79 · #6 Mon, Nov 1, 2010 1:40 PM

davemac wrote:
If interested...it looks like Radar is offering a ridiculously low closeout price on the 2010 Senate

www.radarskistore.com/products/productd … 0.0.0.0.0?

Great info! -that price is just plain sick!!!

tzorn · #7 Mon, Nov 1, 2010 2:21 PM

I'm 6'3", 230 lbs, 48 yrs young, big-framed former footballer, ski at 33 MPH, 50% course, and 50% open water on a pretty big lake that can get real rough, so similar to you I guess, except I've been slaloming for only 5 years. I've been on 68 3/4" A1 for over a year, and use double Wileys. Very pleased with this stick. Previously, I had a 68" Annex but it was too small for me, and after a month on it, gave it to my son. Prior to the A1 and Annex, I skied a 71" Triumph w/ double Wileys (XLs) and thought that was a great ski at 32 MPH, and it is certainly course capable too. I still have the Triumph and could sell it w/bindings at a very nice number if interested, as it didn't get used this year (thought I'd keep it for those rough water afternoons) as I really settled into the A1 for everything. I'm not sure what brand you have a preference for, but would say if you're skiing in the lower 30's, anything under a 69" ski is going to take more work than it needs to (deepwater starts, corners, etc.). Good luck finding the right match!

HO410 · #8 Mon, Nov 1, 2010 3:53 PM

I think the theory is class of ski.

Of the skis listed in the first post, the one that doesn't belong is the A1. The F1x is similar to the Senate C. The Triumph is going to be a lot like the Theory. What you'll find is that the slightly wider ski will give you a more stable and forgiving platform that will be most helpful in rough water.

Sizing. The reason it looks like you are off the scale on Radar is that their sizing chart assumes a speed as slow as 26mph. 30mph on a big Senate or Theory should feel just fine.

maverick2 · #9 Mon, Nov 1, 2010 7:24 PM

Thanks all for the feedback -- very helpful! Just made some arrangements to test-drive a Ski Centurion Barefoot Warrior this week, so between that and the ski advice, next years' waterski season is looking up on all fronts!

ricar116 · #10 Wed, Nov 10, 2010 7:47 PM

I am 46 6'5" 235 mostly open water. Skiied a 69 non carbon Senate all summer. The Senate will rock, however the ski likes faster boat speeds with more weight. Try one out, at 265 you may need to run greater than 35 mph to make the ski work. I have just started running the course on a Theory because the Senate would not go slow enough to learn the course. The Theory will support me on the course at 43 KPH 26.7MPH. The Theory was a pleasant surprise. If you do not want to go warp 6 try the Theory. However I have not had the Theory on open water at higher speeds. Radars 2011 line is Strada derived with more surface area that might work to your advantage. Obrien is bringing back the Synchro this year, If you can find a 71" Triumph that might be a good ski to support you. Definately try them out. Different skis support different styles. Good Luck
Rick

Last edited by ricar116 (Wed, Nov 10, 2010 7:48 PM)

maverick2 · #11 Wed, Nov 10, 2010 11:58 PM

Thanks! I'm intrigued by the 2011 Radars' having a little larger footprint. I'm looking forward to getting back on the water and playing with the different skis.

HO410 · #12 Thu, Nov 11, 2010 5:33 PM

It's a pretty interesting selling point on Radar skis. It's either unique in the ski industry, or Radar is just the first company to make a very clear point of it. Every ski in it's lineup is a Strada with variations in width, length, and materials. At their core though, bevels and rocker lines are the same.